Series 1 Fan balde

A final note, I installed the Cool Cat and am very happy. I have had a few hot day tests and it stayed right on 80.
Thanks for all the advice and interest
Dick

"I have prepared a two page checklist for those struggling with cooling system problems, drop me an email if you'd like a copy."

Michael, please send me the checklist...I'm always willing to learn!

Patrick McLoad
mcloadgmail.com

(The rest of youse guys stay away!! ;-)

Edited on 2008-05-13 13:16:14

Mike

I was just reminded that it's always wise to read messages at least twice before reaching a conclusion. :-(

On my first reading of your message of 2008 - 05 - 07 I thought you were saying that the relay coil drew more current than the motor. I then ran some tests on my unit and came back for a second reading.

I see now that you're saying that the relay coil adds more current draw than a straight switch . That's true. I measured the current draw of my relay coil to be 212 ma at 11.0 VDC. (engine not running---pacemaker aboard)

George:

Cam timing is on my list. Not only is it important to get it right, but if you use modified cams, then things can really change. Running a long duration cam has the same effect as dropping compression ratio. Same thing happens if exhaust cam timing is advanced, while retarding the exhaust cam raises dynamic compression ratio. Changes like these are sometimes made to affect engine output, but there's also an impact on cooling.

A huge problem is erosion of the bypass passage. Because the lowest pressure and highest temperatures exist at the point the bypass enters the thermostat housing, this area is prone to cavitation. A blasted and pitted bypass opening will screw up the entire cooling system, but is often overlooked.

I really enjoyed this thread. Lots of great discussion and solid info. Thanks to all. The more I learn the more I understand.

Mike thanks for the information. Speculation is no good substitute for properly conducted tests such as yours.

Mike I thank you for that honest reply and admire you for it--I have seen your product and it is well done--I am just a purist and have found over the years that the OEM stuff works well too--if and this is a big if all is in good condition. I live in a very hot climate also and have never had a car or customers car overheat that did not have a bigger problem. I would like to see a copy of your checklist and assume that cam timing is one of the checks--I have found that a car that has all good components with a clean engine will experience cronic overheating if the cams are but one tooth out. This happens a lot these days as rebuilders do not recheck cam timing after they tighten the chain. BTW for the series 2 and 1968 guys there were numerous buletins about the temp gauge. My 69 coupe w/ac will run almost in the red on a hot day in traffic---but if you check it that is only 190 or so---if it is not puking water it is not overheated-and too cool is no good also folk---one last thing--the fuel we had when these cars were new made them run a bit cooler--not with the mash of today--Mike once again hats off to your candor!

The omission of a relay on certain vintage E-Types wasn't a great idea. The probable reason why this was done was cost, but it could also be that they were trying to conserve the small amount of current available to them...a relay coil draws a little more amperage than the fan on a straight switch.

There is a lot of speculation that there's no need for the fan on the highway, and that the fan is more of an obstruction than a help when the car is in motion. I've done instrumented tests, and I can assure you that the fan is ALWAYS additive to airflow at speed. While the car may run well without a fan on the highway, you're better off with it than without it.. There may be some limiting speed, but you won't hit it in day to day driving.

Wow, what did I start! But all very interesting and useful. Thanks to all for their suggestions. Michael Frank, I would like a copy, but I think I'll still try the CoolCat. Everything seems to work correctly but the temperature creeps up a bit on long idles. Not overheating just enough to scare me.

Thanks Dick
thigpenrerols.com

I would appreciate your sending me a copy of your booklet.

Having been spoiled with the A/C in my other vehicles I wimp-out and limit the amount of driving of my '63 coupe when the ambient exceeds 85 to 90.

A little off-topic but possibly of some interest, I mounted a relay on the expansion (?) tank bracket and added an override switch with indicator light. The otter switch now just operates the relay and indicator light which eliminates at least a little voltage drop in that switch and perhaps extends the life of the switch.

Since the '63 has a generator rather than an alternator, my (unproven) theory was that the fan does little if any cooling at freeway speeds and shutting it down allows more recharging current to be delivered to the battery,

I'll admit that there's a certain degree of danger in this if you overlook the indcator light calling for the fan when you're traveling at lower speeds. tvtomsbcglobal.net

I am the manufacturer of the CoolCat fan. Let me say something surprising here: George is absolutely right. The stock setup should work adequately in almost all conditions. When I was designing the fan, I did some flow measurements to see how much air the stock S1 fan would actually move. Maybe 600 CFM in optimum condition. This doesn't seem like a lot, especially when you compare to modern fans. But out of curiousity, I measured the airflow behind the waterpump-mounted fan on my '66 Plymouth, with an engine of comparable size. At idle, 600 cfm. The difference is that as the Plymouth engine rises above idle speed, the fan draws more air. (This also means that the Plymouth fan is a HUGE drag at high RPM's).

The significance of this may be that at proper idle speed, the E-Type fan should be no worse than the fans used in most cars through the 1960's, while at high speed it will produce less parasitic power loss. My theory is that a lot of overheating stems from high idle speed, poor mixture, or inaccurate timing. Of course, some of it is caused by fan output becoming compromised after 40 years. The Coolcat fan will move more air, which will certainly improve things. But I think that if everything is just so, the stock fan is adequate. I have prepared a two page checklist for those struggling with cooling system problems, drop me an email if you'd like a copy.

I gotta agree with Patrick on this one. I overhauled the radiator, water pump, flushed out the system on my '68 with the twin fan Series II set up and I still could not get it to run cool in Houston summer temperatures. Once I put on the Cool Cat fans and blades I have had no more trouble. Always stays around the mid-range of the NORMAL scale. Another benefit is that there is a big load on the fuse that runs the fans, at least on my Series 1.5. These new fans draw less current yet flow much more air and seem to have lessened the load on that fuse. I used to have a '66 Series I and broke out laughing when I saw the lawn mower blade that posed as a cooling fan blade on it. I would be suprised if one of those could work effectively in the southern USA in the summer. My 2 cents

David
'68 FHC

I have had the radiator cleaned, the water pump rebuilt, the proper type thermostat installed, the timing checked and the proper radiator cap installed and I still stand by my earlier statement. Pistols at dawn anyone? :-)

Tom

Get your radiator pressure checked. If it is clogged and rusty no fan or motor will prevent over heating.

Well, if you say so George, but in 98 degree heat, stuck at a long light here in Houston or in a long line of traffic, I have found that not to be the case. Respectfully, with a series 1 E-Type you are either moving or over-heating.

Patrick

Patrick sorry but if all systems are in good shape the original system works very well!.

Edited on 2008-05-06 15:01:29

I respectfully disagree with the fan modification, the original fan motor and blade if working efficiently -that is, a good motor- are perfect.

To do anything OTHER than to install a CoolCat unit, or, install some other type of electric fan against the radiator of a Series 1 E-Type, will be the same as pounding sand...a waste of time. Yes, it is not authentically correct, and you will be deducted points at concours. But if you have a driver and don't care about authenticity, then its the only way to go. (This assumes that your radiator, coolant, and water pump are in good working condition).

IMHO, you can continue to visit this problem over and over again, or take care of it once and for all.

Patrick

Thanks Patrick (and others)
I think I'll give it a try. My experience seems like that of Billy above. (Maybe if I could spell blade, I'd do better!)
RKT

The fan motor on my '63 E-Type is in good working order but, in stop and go traffic at 85 to 90 degree ambient temperatures, it simply does not move enough air.

I'm a little confused by the second item on the Cool Cat list. It says it's for a Series ii but " replaces the square type".

My motor is more or less square but not Series II. The fan blades on the second item do appear to be for the Series II.

Why are you changing it? If the motor is weak just replace it with the modified type, if the blade is distorted get a new one.

Richard: The reccomended replacement fan is the Cool Cat, and it is here:
http://coolcatcorp.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=CS

These work great, and I have never had a cooling problem after installation. The CoolCat uses its own motor, but it fits in the existing motor bracket, and, uses the existing wiring, so you don't have to cut any wires.

It is a slight pain to install as you need to tilt the radiator forward a bit to install the motor and fan (separately). This means you will have to remove the upper hoses and the two brackets that connect the rad to the header tank. You still need a good seal around the fan shroud so that air is pulled through the radiator only, and, the proper mix of coolant and water.

Personally, I would not rely on the little otter switch to turn the fan on at temperature; I prefer to havve it wired directly so that you hear the fan moving when you turn on the ignition. Of course, save your original motor and blade. Once the CoolCat is installed, you can barely see it, and again, it works great!

Patrick